It is not definitive that the frog was causative regarding all water sounds. While the two activities have been paired up for years, a third possibility is present: Basho heard the sound of water before the frog jumped in, possibly adding to that sound — therefore, two sounds in the end. How would he know he jumped in? Do we know much about this pond. Is it stagnant?
Old Pond School
Is there a little stream or trickle leading into it like many ponds have? Does ancient mean stagnant? Fu-ru old i-ke pond ya, ka-wa-zu frog to-bi-ko-mu jumping into mi-zu water no o-to sound. Was the water sound already present with the addition of the frog sound?
The old pond - Poem by Matsuo Basho
Are there two sounds Basho is getting at? Possibly there is even more activity going on here than commonly thought? For me the compelling factor is surprise. It could come from a need for affirmation that one is a poet, which is a poor excuse, but not a negligible one. Or it could come from the compulsion that things objects as well as inner states seem to have to be seen and felt and experienced as alive and in constant movement, ever changing. That compulsion to be seen may manifest in numerous and strange ways, even by way of experimentation, as for example, devoting a week to writing poems that emphasize one vowel sound, at the end of which one may discover what really wanted to be said and that a hawk or a rusty hinge had something to do with it, as well as an unseen door within oneself behind which a caged raptor was calling to be set free.
About Old Pond
Basho when crafting his old pond poem was also considering other words for a toriawase for example. A haiku is an experience, where the poet is leading his normal life, practising awareness and suddenly becomes aware of something special … a haiku is born. The AHA moment is not a common expression in Japan. A deskku is said to be one where the poet sits down with the intention : Now I am going to write a haiku about xyz kigo or xyz keyword. Of course hopefully he takes the material from memories and past experience, or uses his imagination and wit, but anywy ….
Once the poet has his inspriration from an experience, usually in two lines of a haiku, he now looks for an appropriate kigo in his vocabulary. Poetry needs finetuning and crafting like any other craft, and toriawase is one step in this direction. Such knowledge here awes me no end so much so that my first impulse has been to demur from sharing what I feel as a forever-novice in this genre.
But perhaps my thoughts might help you guide other would-be haiku poets. Here is where I stand:. For me, the senses hardly ever capture stimuli as is but recreate them. Myers, who is going to stir up by my statement, assuming that we are both referring to English Language haiku? Scott, Yes, you are right. Thanks for clarifying. My post does look confusing in that regard.
So, what do we do; live with it? Now, I am assuming that we are referring to: English Language Haiku? Here is the west, haiku forums are going tokill the genre. We have become an society of co authors. And sure, a haiku can be written in the moment. Probably all of my bird haiku were written within the moment. My otter scat poem that Jim included within his Per Diem theme was a free poem, gees, even my infamous pissing poem was within in the moment, like any good father, you have toteach your five year old son how to write their name: yellow in snow.
Come on, a haiku is a genre of observation too and a nature poem. Sure, you can write a haiku in the moment, I just choose not to write them down, if I forget the moment, well then; it is lost. I pobably would have given up haiku for the third time. Within email corresponence, MDW beat the poem out of me, and Christopher to the selfishness out of the poem. If you use imaginary pictures you will get both good and bad haiku, but the good ones will be very rare.
If you use real pictures, it is still difficult to get very good haiku, but it is comparatively easy to get second-class ones, which will keep some value after the lapse of years. Kai, as David Burleigh points out in his excellent and extensive article about him in Modern Haiku He seems very interested, from what i can gather, in how haiku is a poetry of the imagination, and how this aspect is highly important to haiku poetics.
Old Pond Syndrome
Basho wrote an activity koto, process biased haiku that is remembered and studied centuries later. Haiku is haiku. For those with spiritual leanings, to be exactly IN the moment is the goal, striving to enlightenment or satori. A reader conceivably may be enlightened by the act of reading the haiku, which is even further removed from the moment.
Regardless, spiritual or no, the moment is key and how it is captured and communicated is the poem. I hear ya about it being late Don?
I ment to write: Jacob Ryan. It is also very clear that Basho was not in view of any pond at all and nor did he actually see a frog. He heard a sound and wrote the poem from there.
Cheshunt Old Pond improvements have been proposed by Broxbourne Council
A small boy could have thrown a rock? Unlikely, but a good point for the discussion. Basho takes the sound as a frog.
But, now what? He desperately needs a fragment. The poem is done — on a situation he never actually observed. I, as well, do not like the term desk-ku. It comes off degrading the art and imagination of writing haiku. The inference is that the poet has done something wrong. The truth of the matter is that all haiku are desk haiku just as Michael has quite nicely outlined.
The frog poem is one that is entirely made up from imagination. I suppose however, that while he worked out the hokku, time was elapsing. In that, as time goes by the experience may become less fresh and therefore, the poem more difficult to write accurately? Possibly this aspect of elapsed time between observation and the writing of the poem might be another excellent subject. In the end … how does the poem work? End of story. Just thinking out loud, randomly at a. When a poet arrives at his or her desk, or takes a forest trail into the unconscious, the inevitable happens.
I agree with Micheal. How can you possibly write well if you do sit down and think about what you are attempting to convey? Do I carry a notepad and pencil around in my pocket; hell no. If you have ever delivered and baptized your child, you would understand. I was sitting there watch the wood ducks and mallards dabble, hooded mergansers and eared grebe dive. Writing is a gift, that does not come easy; there is always a price. Well, unless your partner is another writer? Probably not, and I was probably going through DTs at the time, drinking to heavy while struggling through post mortem depression.
Because of this poor economy many people have been forced to sell their homes. This has created a market flooded with koi for sale. Two times in the last 18 months I have seen individuals who purchased a whole collection of koi watch them all die within one week after introducing them into their existing koi pond. In both cases, the purchased koi had been isolated for over 10 years without being exposed to another koi.
Then after several days they all perk up again. It appears that the new koi introduced a new virus like a cold germ to us and it took a few days for the koi to recover. The problem is when they are isolated for years and then get hit with a bunch of viruses all at the same time. It becomes too much for them to handle. What can you do with this information? Anytime you purchase koi from a private collection, be careful. If they have not added a new koi for years you might wish to bring up the possibility that their koi might be too immune deficient to survive elsewhere.
At that point the two of you might talk about how to handle that possibility. If purchasing a whole collection you might take one or two of the least expensive koi and place them in a tank with one of your koi for one week. You will know if you have a problem within one week. How do you prevent this from happening to your collection? Do not go more than five years without introducing at least one new koi to your collection. I know coming from a koi dealer that this sounds like a sales pitch but the problem is real. Remember me Log in.
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